Terve Juha,
Tervetuloa mukaan Euroopan vapaiden ohjelmistojen säätiön toimintaan!
Suosittelen tutustumaan sivuun
http://www.fsfe.org/contact/community.fi.html
ja liittymään sähköpostilistoille kiinnostuksesi mukaan.
Liity vähintään fsfe-fi@-listalle
(https://mail.fsfeurope.org/mailman/listinfo/fsfe-fi), koska siellä
tiedotetaan ja keskustellaan nimenomaan suomalaisia koskevista asioista.
Keskustelua käydään myös IRC-kanavalla #fsfeurope (Freenode-verkossa) ja
Jabber-palvelimemme huoneessa fellowship(a)conference.jabber.fsfe.org.
IRCissä vapaista ohjelmistoista voi keskustella suomeksi kanavalla
#vapaakoodi (Freenode).
Jos haluat tavoittaa FSFE:n Suomen tiimin, joka koordinoi toimintaa
Suomessa, lähetä viestiä osoitteeseen finland(a)fsfe.org.
--
Otto Kekäläinen [] otto(a)fsfe.org
Finnish Team Coordinator [][][] GPG/PGP 0xB7F7E4E1
Free Software Foundation Europe || +358 44 566 2204
http://www.fsfe.org/ finland(a)fsfe.org
Moro,
Riku Tallimies tulee Suomeen ja sovittiin että käydään lounaalla
FSFE-tiimin kanssa 6.11. klo 12:00.
Ketkä haluaa tulla mukaan? Mikä olisi sopiva paikka, mun pitää
ehdottaa jotain. Martin, oliko se yksi ravintola nimeltään Kuu ?
--
Otto Kekäläinen [] otto(a)fsfe.org
Finnish Team Coordinator [][][] finland(a)fsfe.org
Free Software Foundation Europe || +358 44 566 2204
Support FSFE! http://fsfe.org/support?otto
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Kiitoksia palautteestanne.
Olemme tarjouspyynnössämme pyytäneet tarjousta nykyisin Seinäjoen kaupungilla olevien ohjelmiston lisenssien jatkohankinnasta, eli jatkamme käytössä olevan järjestelmän elinkaarta. Kaupungin kasvun myötä lisenssien määrän tarve on myös lisääntynyt. Olemme saaneet tarjouspyyntöömme tarjouksen kolmelta eri toimijalta, joten hankintamme ei ole suosinut yksittäistä toimijaa, vaan on hyödyntänyt olemassa olevia markkinoita ja vallitsevaa kilpailuasetelmaa. Esitetty näkemys siitä, että tarjouspyynnössä tulisi olla maininta "tai vastaava" on tässä yhteydessä perusteeton, sillä lisenssi kohdistu tiettyyn tuotteeseen, joka kaupungilla on käytössä ja jota tullaan käyttämään edelleen. Emme katso, että olisimme toimineet vastoin hankintalakia, koska olemme ilmoittaneet hyvin yksityiskohtaisesti ne reunaehdot, jotka ovat tarjoajille olleet välttämättömiä tarjouksen tekemiseksi. Emme hanki tiettyä tuotetta, vaan käyttöoikeutta käytössämme olevalle tuotteelle.
Varsinainen järjestelmän hankinta on aikanaan toteutettu vaatimusmäärittelyyn perustuen ja on siten ollut avoin eri toimijoille. Käyttäjällä, myös julkisella sektorilla on oikeus päättää käytössään olevien tuotteiden elinkaaresta, jotka voivat muuttua alkuperäisistä suunnitelmista. Tämä saattaa edellyttää mm. lisenssien uusimista. Käyttämänne lähestymistapa, jossa ilmoitetaan hankintayksikön toimineen lakia rikkoen saattaa edesauttaa tilannetta, jossa tämän kaltaisia hankintoja suoritetaan ilman avoimuutta, esimerkiksi suorahankintana tai pienemmissä osissa, jolloin avointa kilpailuttamisvelvollisuutta ei ole. Seinäjoen kaupunki hankintayksikkönä toimii huomattavasti avoimemmin kuin hankintalaki edellyttää. Jos tämän periaatteen noudattaminen aiheuttaa meille kuitenkin ongelmia tai uhkaa johtaa tilanteeseen, jotka lisäävät esimerkiksi kustannuksiamme, joudumme toki arvioimaan, millainen lainmukainen hankintapolitiikka on meille tarkoituksenmukaisin.
Kiitämme kuitenkin palautteestanne. Lisäksi haluaisin muistuttaa, että antaessanne meille palautetta samasta aiheesta vuonna 2011 keskustelin Otto Kekäläisen kanssa puhelimitse ja hän lupasi tuolloin toimittaa konkreettista materiaalia, jota hyödyntämällä voimme edelleen parantaa toimintaamme. En kuitenkaan muista saaneeni häneltä aiheesta sähköpostia. Jos juuri tähän hankintaan soveltuvaa materiaalia lähettämänne lisäksi on mahdollista saada, pyydän sen meille toimittamaan.
Terveisin,
Mikko Tanhuamäki
materiaalipäällikkö
Seinäjoen kaupunki
Materiaalihallinto
p. 06 416 2140 / 044 425 5111
________________________________
Lähettäjä: Heli Pohjoisaho [mailto:heli.pohjoisaho@hhpartners.fi]
Lähetetty: 26. lokakuuta 2012 9:22
Vastaanottaja: hankinta yleinen sp
Kopio: Martin von Willebrand
Aihe: Huomautus hankinnan syrjivyydestä
Ystävällisin terveisin
Heli Pohjoisaho
asianajosihteeri
Asianajotoimisto HH Partners Oy
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Tiedoksi Seinajoelle mennyt kirje, mukana ollut myös oheinen infoliite.
T: Martin
Lähettäjä: Heli Pohjoisaho
Lähetetty: 26. lokakuuta 2012 9:22
Vastaanottaja: hankinta(a)seinajoki.fi
Kopio: Martin von Willebrand
Aihe: Huomautus hankinnan syrjivyydestä
Ystävällisin terveisin
Heli Pohjoisaho
asianajosihteeri
Asianajotoimisto HH Partners Oy
Käyntiosoite: Bulevardi 7, 5. krs, 00120 Helsinki
PL 232, 00101 Helsinki
Puhelin 09 177 613, faksi 09 653 873
GSM 040 774 6730
heli.pohjoisaho(a)hhpartners.fi<mailto:heli.pohjoisaho@hhpartners.fi>
Legal 500 ranks HH Partners as a leading law firm. See details at hhpartners.fi<http://www.hhpartners.fi/posts/legal-500-recommends-hh-partners-as-a-leadin…>.
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very much enjoyed the presentation pdf file... noticed some typos:
Slide 3: ... should be "in the last two years" rather than "during"
Slide 4: ... ", who come?"... should be ". How come?"
Slide 7: ... "data is hold hostage" ... should be "held" ...
planning escaping --> planning to escape ...
slide 23: ... abbreviated TOC ... should be TCO ? or was it really TOC?
slide 43: ... Never Lose! (not Loose!)
fwiw, I think the talk overstates the political support for open source.
German Foreign Ministry, after all, transitioned back to Windows after
their Linux deployment was completed.
It shows that the opposition is fierce even after the transition is done:
https://joinup.ec.europa.eu/news/de-ministry-foreign-affairs-ditch-open-sou…
Hello,
Is there something we should do? Could FSFE help raise awareness about
Oracle and steer people to use the fork MariaDB?
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Michael Widenius <michael.widenius(a)gmail.com>
Date: 2012/10/29
Subject: MariaDB
To: otto.kekalainen(a)seravo.fi
Kopio: "Michael \"Monty\" Widenius" <monty(a)askmonty.org>, Rasmus
Johansson <rasmus(a)askmonty.org>
Hi Otto
I hope you remember me; I am the founder of MariaDB and MySQL.
I am writing to you as we met at an conference some time back and you
showed interest in MySQL/MariaDB.
The short story is that we are seeking after companies who are willing
to help/work with us to ensure that MySQL & MariaDB will continue to
exist in the future.
As You may be aware of, Oracle is actively monopolizing MySQL
development (against the principles of Open Source):
- New 'enterprise' extensions in MySQL are closed source:
http://monty-says.blogspot.fi/2011/09/oracle-adding-close-source-extensions…
- The bugs database is not public anymore
http://mysqlha.blogspot.fi/2011/02/where-have-bugs-gone.htmlhttp://ronaldbradford.com/blog/when-is-a-crashing-mysql-bug-not-a-bug-2012-…
- The MySQL public repositories are not anymore actively updated.
http://www.mysqlperformanceblog.com/2012/08/16/where-to-get-a-bzr-tree-of-t…
- Security problems are not communicated nor addressed quickly.
(This is making Linux distributions very annoyed with Oracle)
- Instead of fixing bugs, Oracle is removing features:
http://www.skysql.com/blogs/kolbe/heads-no-more-query-cache-partitioned-tab…
- New code in MySQL 5.5 doesn't have test cases anymore.
http://lists.mysql.com/internals/38562
- Some of the new code is surprisingly good by Oracle, but
unfortunately the quality varies and a notable part needs to be
rewritten before we can include it in MariaDB
https://lists.launchpad.net/maria-developers/msg04837.html
This is not good news for you. If Oracle gets a true monopoly of MySQL
development they will be able to increase their prices (which they are
already doing), restrict the usage and over time stop the open source
development of MySQL without anyone being able to do anything about
it. We think it is in your interest to have alternatives to Oracle.
It's clear that Oracle wants to be the only entity that is capable
of developing MySQL and wants to earn much more money on MySQL. (Paid by you).
The user community is quite unhappy about this:
http://developers.slashdot.org/story/12/08/18/0152237/is-mysql-slowly-turni…http://techcrunch.com/2012/08/18/oracle-makes-more-moves-to-kill-open-sourc…
The actions by Oracle make it much harder to work on MySQL
forks/competing offerings like MariaDB! To be able to continue our
work of providing a free MySQL based server we need resources. Because
of this we have decided to create MariaDB Foundation to drive MariaDB
development and to ensure that MySQL survives as an actively developed
open source product whatever happens at Oracle.
If you didn't already know it, MariaDB is an branch of MySQL with a
lot of enhancements but still backward compatible with MySQL.
http://kb.askmonty.org/en/mariadb-versus-mysql-features/http://kb.askmonty.org/en/mariadb-versus-mysql-compatibility/
We are now searching for companies that see benefits from MySQL
surviving as the leading open source product and would like to sponsor
the MariaDB Foundation either with money or development resources to
ensure it's survival.
The target is to have the foundation up and running by end of November.
I am happy to send more detailed information about the MariaDB
foundation. If you are interested in helping with MySQL & MariaDB's
survival, please drop us a line!
If you know of others that would be interest to help, please forward
this email to them!
It's only be getting enough companies behind the foundation we can
guarantee that MariaDB will be actively developed!
Best regards,
Michael "Monty" Widenius
Creator and founder of MySQL and MariaDB
--
Otto Kekäläinen [] otto(a)fsfe.org
Finnish Team Coordinator [][][] finland(a)fsfe.org
Free Software Foundation Europe || +358 44 566 2204
Support FSFE! http://fsfe.org/support?otto
Erik,
Just for the record, every time a Finn joins the Fellowship, Matthias
notifies me about that, and then I write them a welcome message in
Finnish and CC Matthias and the Finnish team.
And many of the Fellows join because I recruited them :) For example
Panu is a friend of mine since 1999, though I am not 100% if my
recommendation was the final reason he joined.
It is of course good that somebody contacts them and asks if they want
to contribute in some way. I'm just not sure if this is the best
approach. Maybe you could give the list of Fellows to Timo Lindfors
and he could contact them in Finnish, maybe advertising a specific
date and place to have a Fellowship meeting?
2012/10/23 Erik Albers <eal(a)fsfe.org>:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Dear Panu,
>
> first of all, feeling very sorry for getting in contact with you with such a
> delay. In general, communication inside FSFE is quite direct and quick but we
> had some structural changes in Summer, so we have to catch up with some old
> emails now.
>
> Second, I would like to thank you very much for being a Fellow. The Fellowship
> is in the very heart of FSFE's activities.
>
> You indicated that you would like to get in contact with other Fellows of
> FSFE. Fortunately there is a group of Fellows in Helsinki but I am not that
> sure about its organisation or how and when they meet. AFAIK they do not
> meet in a pure FSFE circle but together with other Free Software enthusiasts.
>
> I am not quite sure who is head of these meetings but I can point you to the
> wiki-page [1] as well as to the Finnish mailing list from FSFE [2]. I also put
> Otto Kekäläinen in CC who is Finnish coordinator and Timo Lindfors who is
> from Helsinki, too. Both will be happy to help you out with all your
> questions concerning FSFE in Finland.
>
> Thank you again for being a Fellow and hope you have the chance to meet
> interesting people.
>
> best regards,
> Erik
>
>
> [1]
> https://wiki.fsfe.org/groups/Helsinki?highlight=%28\bCategoryFellowshipGrou…
> [2] https://mail.fsfeurope.org/mailman/listinfo/fsfe-fi
>
> On 02/09/12 10:53, atehwa(a)sange.fi wrote:
>> A Fellow wishes to be contacted by a local Fellowship group coordinator:
>>
>> Finland, 00790 Helsinki, Panu Kalliokoski, atehwa
>>
>> Best regards, the Fellowship database
>>
>
>
> - --
> Erik Albers | http://fsfe.org/about/albers/albers.en.html
> Free Software Foundation Europe (FSFE) - Campaigns & Community
> Your support is just a few clicks away: http://fsfe.org/support/?eal
>
> Free as in Freedom!
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--
Otto Kekäläinen [] otto(a)fsfe.org
Finnish Team Coordinator [][][] finland(a)fsfe.org
Free Software Foundation Europe || +358 44 566 2204
Support FSFE! http://fsfe.org/support?otto
Hei,
laitanpa tästäkin kopion finland@ -listalle.
-Timo
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Langasek <vorlon(a)debian.org>
Sent: Fri, 26 Oct 2012 19:37:55 -0700
To: Timo Juhani Lindfors <timo.lindfors(a)iki.fi>
Cc: debian-legal(a)lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: National Land Survey open data licence - version 1.0 - 1 May 2012
On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 11:36:30AM +0300, Timo Juhani Lindfors wrote:
> [ Replying to an old thread. For your convenience here's a link to the
> original thread:
> http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2012/05/msg00014.html ]
> Francesco Poli <invernomuto(a)paranoici.org> writes:
> >> > * remove the name of the Licensor from the product or service, if
> >> > required to do so by the Licensor.
> > I am personally convinced that such a requirement is non-free.
> > I think it's very similar to one of the clauses found in CC-v3.0
> > licenses. See for instance my analysis of CC-by-v3.0:
> > https://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2007/07/msg00124.html
> > However, Debian FTP-masters disagree with me on the freeness of
> > works released under the terms of CC-v3.0 licenses:
> > https://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2010/01/msg00084.html
> > Hence, it's *possible* (but not granted) that FTP-masters would consider
> > the above-discussed section 2.2 as acceptable, unfortunately.
> It seems that since CC has such a clause it is getting copied to other
> licenses. I heard of one such license this week:
> "Helsinki Region Infoshare – data pool licence
> 1. The licensor (holder of copyright or associated rights in the
> licensed material) hereby grants the licensee (user of the licensed
> material under the terms of this licence) a global, free of charge,
> non-exclusive, permanent licence to copy, disseminate, edit, combine
> and otherwise use the licensed material according to the terms and
> conditions set out in items 2 and 3 below. The licensed material may
> be used for non-commercial and commercial purposes.
> 2. The original copyright information in the licensed material must
> be acknowledged in the manner indicated by the licensor. This
> attribution must be deleted if so requested by the licensor.
> 3. The copyright details of the licensed material must not be
> attributed in any way that suggests that the publisher of the
> licensed material endorses the user or the use of the data material."
> -- http://www.hri.fi/lisenssit/hri-nimea/
> Note that while CC has "to the extent practicable" to shoften the
> requirement this softening is not present anymore in "National Land
> Survey open data licence" or this "Helsinki Region Infoshare – data pool
> licence".
> Could this "to the extend practicable" be the key difference why CC
> would be considered free but these two new licenses would not?
Does Finnish law recognize the concept of author's rights (moral rights)?
It appears that the intent of this clause is to reassert a right that is
already granted by law in some jurisdictions: the right for their name not
to be associated with a mutilated form of their work.
If this were a license used by a copyright holder in France or Germany,
where I know such moral rights exist, then I believe this clause would be a
no-op and should therefore be ignored when evaluating the freeness of the
license. When used by a Finnish copyright holder, I'm not sure; this may be
an example of a "tentacles of evil" effect from the license. There's also
the fact that, as worded, it does *not* refer to the author, it refers to
the Licensor who may be a different party.
So it's possible that there are some bugs in the wording, of both the CC
license and the licenses you cite. I do think, however, that they're
compatible in *intent* with the DFSG, which has explicit provisions
regarding the integrity of authors' works. Requiring a rename or requiring
changes be carried as patches is not conceptually different from requiring
removal of attribution. None of these requirements are something we
recommend to authors, but they are free.
The National Land Survey license does have a pretty major bug that the other
two do not, due to differences in wording (another example of why people
shouldn't write their own licenses):
* remove the name of the Licensor from the product or service, if required
to do so by the Licensor.
This does *not* say that you must remove the name from the *attribution*.
It says you must remove the name, which implies you must remove it from
anywhere it appears, including in functional elements.
In practice, if someone wanted to package data distributed under this
license, they could sanitize that data by proactively removing any
occurrences of the Licensor's name first *except* for the credits; once
done, this degenerates to the previous case. But it's obviously a hassle to
do that.
All in all, with respect to these clauses I side with the ftp masters (who
have already accepted CC-BY-SA 3.0) and believe they're DFSG-compatible,
though I would definitely not recommend any of these clauses.
--
Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer http://www.debian.org/
slangasek(a)ubuntu.com vorlon(a)debian.org